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Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
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Posted - 2012.08.01 09:03:00 -
[1] - Quote
Hello,
CRUs, Supply depot, turrets : All those structures are way too weak and exposed to damage that cannot be compensate with repair guns. It's problematic as more than 90% of the games i play, more than 4 on 5 structures gets taken out.
Turrets:
With a regular assault forge gun, it takes only 5 to 6 shots to take down a turret. I would have thought that those pretty big defensive structure would be a LOT stronger than this. Now, with people who skilled on HAV, a fight between a turret and a tank is just ridiculous. An HAV, even a strong one, shouldnt be able to take down a turret on its own without taking massive risks. Two pretty well armed HAV should take it down. Two basic crappy HAV should get blown up in no time. I mean, those big turrets aren't made to counter infantry are
=> Boost Turrets HP and maybe damages : This would avoid a lot of troubles regarding vehicles just rocking the world at every game.... And it would force some interactions between HAV and infantry. One counting on the other to hack those basterd's down.
=> So HAV can have a shield booster and auto-rep while moving and turrets seems to have the lowest shield regen ever ? Raise it a bit.
=> Avoid direct opposition of turrets. On plateus, starting turrets can directly fire at each other ! It's to whoever reaches the turrets first. That's pretty damn stupid imo.
Regarding CRUs and supply depot:
For those two, being kinda weak and easily destroyed would make sense as they're note defensive structures. Still, they get destroyed way too often for various reason. Either people are stupid destroying the damn thing ( 80% of the time) or the structure is poorly placed.
=> This shouldnt be a problem when corp and commander roles will be implemented as logis and commander will be able to set a new supply depot \ CRUs \ etc... on various spots. But, in high sec where those functions will never be available, there should be ways to have destroyed structures back in the game. After all, the attacking NPC contracter is actually launching structures when the fight begins. Why couldnt he set up replacement structures something like 3 minutes after it's been destroyed ?
Same goes for defense.
=> It would avoid having a team crippled after only 5 minutes by having no more turrets, CRUs etc.... And get pinned downed at its spawn. Camping the red line wouldnt be so smart if you can have a CRU being dropped in the back spawning 10 ennemies !
=> Regarding poorly placed structures, Plateus is really a piece of work ! Compared to the bigger skirmishes we had last build, it's a complete non-sense : Turrets facing each other at the start ( 2 are blown up after 2 minutes no matter what side). Direct line of fire on the two offensive CRU and even the supply depot (wich is VERY badly placed also)
And i'm not even talking of the 10 sec delay to spawn in the freshly placed CRUs that makes the right attacking CRU pretty much useless if you're facing a decent opposition. Maybe fresh structures should have some sort of anti-hacking system for a couple of minutes.
Destroyable structures so you can offer modes where players are also in charge of dealing with those and set them in the right places ? Good idea. BUT it shouldnt become a building fest either. Investing in a CRU\turret should cost good money to a corp. Thus, limiting building loss should also be an objective. For that, we need stronger stuff.
Suggestions :
=> Add moderate amount of HP to CRU and supply depot. Raise shield regen slightly.
=> Add a good amount of HP tp turrets and raise damage inflicted. Raise shield regen
=> Add a "no-hack" period on fresh structures.
=> Avoid Plateus mistakes. Especially the turrets facing each other. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.01 11:52:00 -
[2] - Quote
Dewie Cheecham wrote:
I KNEW those assault riffles were OP. It takes my main gun on the HAV 2-3 shots to kill a turret, or CRU, an AR doing it in 5-6 means that little gun does 1000+ HP damage???
Just kidding.
I think you misred me. I'm talking about forge guns, not AR 
And i maintain that a regular Forge Gun shouldnt take down a turret in 6 shots. It should be more like 15 shots. Maybe a fully skilled Forge gun could take out those turrets in less than 8-10 shots.
Otherwise, i'm glad to see you guys overall feel the same way about those structures.
I'm well aware that we'll be able to call on those in the future as i mentionned it. But, for some reason i dont see this function being available in High-Sec where battles are set and mostly directed by NPC corp.
on the other hand, i didnt hear anything regarding different types of turrets, CRU etc... But i wouldnt be surprised at all to see that. Even though i dont think we'll get to "fit" those. But again, those "evolved" structures will probably be mostly used on security spaces where battles are fully runned by players. There, the balance is in the hand of the players.
Regarding fight between HAV and turrets, i maintain a heavy HAV shouldnt be able to storm by itsefl a turret with 1-2 guys with decent swarmlaunchers/ AV grenade. A weak HAV shouldnt resist more than 15 seconds.
Why ? because this game is all about teamplay : Remote shield boosters, remote armor repairer etc.. NEEDS to be usefull.
Thus, strong turrets with a decent infantry cover should require from a good HAV player to have backup. Not just roll around everywhere and destroy everything while sipping a fresh fruit cocktail. lol.
I also see you guys think that those first turrets on plateus make absolutely no sense at all. Regarding supply depot, i'm not saying they're all misplaced. Just the first on Plateus for the attackers is a pure gift to the defender. Like the CRU.
When i defend, i rush out from A with my forge : destroy the CRU, then hack the supply depot and snipe every turret\CRU i can see.
=> With decent partners, there's nothing left (both CRU, turrets) in less than 4-5 minutes. And we got a brand new supply depot. Doesnt feel right. Why would an attacker send out structures this far ? Right in front ennemy turrets ? Old Skirmishes were overall solid maps ! With a sort stronghold for defenders. Much more clever.
About the dropping structure function : Yes, we shall be able to call on every kind of structures and more importantly, whatever structures on whatever layout that's the right size. For instance, call out a supply depot where there would usually be a turret or CRU. Same way that on similar "Height maps" the main outpost could be located in various locations etc...
For those who never watched or red anything about the "Scaling the Universe" conference from the last FanFest, i recommand it. It's full of very interesting informations ! Check out youtube or dust514.org. Dust514-france if you're francophone
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Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.01 12:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
I agree destroying some building is more interesting than a capture sometimes. Especially with CRU.
Thus, i dont suggest we make building Rock-Solid. Just a bit more tough so they dont get blown up by one guy alone in less than a minute. ^^
Or, an option to use a self-destruct hacking sequence could be added. Would take longer to be set up and then maybe 2 minutes to blow up ? |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.01 13:51:00 -
[4] - Quote
i guess. But even a 60 hp\sec on armor wont compete with the damage of an heavy HAV or forge gun. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.01 14:24:00 -
[5] - Quote
could be. Yet Command suit won't be dedicated to structures at all.
Logi will be able to call on some of the structures. (small ones) Most will be called down by the commander (wich may not use suits at all in its MCC) |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.02 07:40:00 -
[6] - Quote
I really dont think we'll get to fit turrets with shield boosters\extenders and such. Developping building fitting tool wouldnt be that much interesting. Maybe waaaaaay later. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.02 09:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:Laurent Cazaderon wrote:I really dont think we'll get to fit turrets with shield boosters\extenders and such. Developping building fitting tool wouldnt be that much interesting. Maybe waaaaaay later. A building fitting tool would literally be exactly the same as a dropsuit or vehicle fitting tool... All they would have to do is change the model in the background. I don't see how that wouldn't make sense, we are already using something very similar to the fitting tool in EVE, we just control it with a DS3 rather than a mouse.
I know that....
But adding a new layer of gameplay with customized building isnt just about a menu and a background..... You must add specific game mechanics so those building are now affected by modules. It's work. Also, this would pretty much mean creating new modules. A lot of work too.
And not everyone will have use of this function as not everyone will get to call on buildings to the ground. So may not be that usefull.
And you're mentionning EVE. Well in Eve, you dont get to add modules to your POS gun battery or player owned station etc.. So why would dust offer this possibility ?
=> Just change the native spec of those structures to make them tougher. And maybe add some new turrets for player-runned battles. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.08.06 07:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
gentle bump ^^ |
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